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Governor Phil Murphy Fights with CNBC’s Joe Kernen Over Taxes and ‘Squawk Box’ Policy

NEW YORK — New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy and CNBC host Joe Kernen engaged in a heated debate over taxes, national policy issues and the Democratic Party’s agenda on Monday’s episode of “Squawk Box.” Kernen, a longtime New Jersey resident, pressed Murphy on whether he supported progressive taxation policies and other left-leaning proposals linked to Vice President Kamala Harris, sparking a lively back-and-forth that often veered into personal territory.

• While New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy was discussing tax fairness and progressive policies with CNBC host Joe Kernen on “Squawk Box,” Kernen pressed Murphy on whether current tax rates are fair.
• Murphy defended New Jersey’s millionaire tax, citing an increase in the number of wealthy residents since its implementation, despite initial concerns that the tax would deport high-income earners.
• The conversation expanded into broader Democratic policies; Kernen questioned Murphy’s stance on fraud, unrealized capital gains tax and nationalized energy, but Murphy avoided responding directly to specific proposals.
• Murphy and Kernen also sparred over the alleged politicization of the Justice Department; Murphy expressed disbelief in the comparison between the current administration and Trump’s, suggesting that no “rational viewer” would view Vice President Kamala Harris as a greater threat to democracy than Trump.

The conversation turned confrontational when Kernen challenged Murphy on his views on tax fairness. “I live in your state, Governor,” Kernen said. “Do you think it would be fair for me if I pay 55% of the total (in taxes), or do I have to pay 80%?” Murphy, who advocated for a millionaire’s tax in New Jersey, said his goal was to ensure tax policy was fair but stopped short of proposing specific thresholds.

Murphy noted the state’s economic successes under his leadership, citing the increase in the number of wealthy residents since the millionaire tax was enacted. “Five years ago we passed a millionaire’s tax. Everyone, Joe, including you, said it would drive people away from New Jersey,” Murphy said. “We have more millionaires today than we’ve ever had in our history.”

When asked about President Biden calling New Jersey Trump supporters trash, the governor defended the President.

“Were Trump supporters trash? I saw him and he said, “This was specifically about the people at Madison Square Garden, and you and I both know he said that,” Murphy said.

Pressing for clarity, Kernen questioned Murphy on a number of progressive policies; He asked about his stance on fraud, unrealized capital gains tax and nationalized energy. Murphy avoided specifics, arguing that his views on fair tax policy are informed by a commitment to providing value to residents for their contributions. “We’re not a low-cost state to live in, but we give you a tremendous amount back for what you pay for,” Murphy said, emphasizing that New Jersey is “the number one state for raising a family in America.”

When asked about New York City District Attorney Alvin Bragg’s criminal case against Trump, Murphy had an answer.

“Alvin Bragg does not work for Kamala Harris. “You and I both know this,” he said.

“Well, you know I live in your state, governor. Would that be fair to me if I paid 55% total or do you think I should pay 80%? What would be fair for you? Because I live in your state,” Kernen, a New Jersey resident, asked the governor. “We’re not a low-cost state to live in, but we give you a huge amount back for what you pay.”

“Joe, I said this from the beginning. Believe me, I know it is. But you make it sound like you’re on the Trump campaign,” Murphy replied.

When asked about the lawsuit against Trump, Murphy said: “Come on. You’ve got to be kidding me. Speaker 1 (04:22)
There is no rational viewer watching this debate right now who thinks Harris is an authority threat to Trump. There is no reasonable person who could come to this conclusion. How could you?

As the conversation continued, it shifted towards broader ideological debates; Kernen argued that the current administration’s Justice Department has become politicized, comparing it to former President Donald Trump’s administration. Murphy backtracked, expressing disbelief in the idea and pointing to recent events and Trump’s public statements about revenge against political rivals. “There is no rational viewer watching this debate right now who thinks Harris is an authority threat to Trump,” Murphy said. “There is no reasonable person who would come to that conclusion.”

The conversation ended with co-host Andrew Ross Sorkin trying to add context by recalling Trump’s previous efforts to pursue investigations against political figures like James Comey and Hillary Clinton despite resistance from his own administration. “I want to be 100% clear about the context of this,” Sorkin said, calling the example “real.”

The heated debate highlighted sharp ideological divisions between Murphy, a Democrat known for his progressive policies in New Jersey, and Kernen, a financial journalist who has frequently criticized left-leaning tax and economic proposals. The speech highlighted the ongoing national debate over economic policy, fairness in taxation, and the scope of government power.